Those wrong ones

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imyourmomma_{HoF}
Posts: 41
Joined: Sat Sep 23, 2017 4:29 pm

Re: Those wrong ones

Post by imyourmomma_{HoF} » Mon Jan 22, 2018 3:26 pm

I can wait until Nelsona looks at it.

Nelsona
Posts: 271
Joined: Sat Sep 30, 2017 5:03 am

Re: Those wrong ones

Post by Nelsona » Tue Jan 23, 2018 6:31 am

Probably I'll take a look over it and making a small break with Tarmation2 thingy.
Tarmation2 do seems to test my patience. When I could see things working properly, I was always finding a spot in game where wall did not collide, where a surface was flickering, there are a lot of fixes required to not mention that big open area is a brush scaled to a funky value which won't match the grid ever. Some dude in a tutorial said that random flickering surfaces are coming from rendering and we can get used with it. I believe is about a BSP problem and NOTHING ELSE, render being unable to figure an exact point or such because of a BAD aligned thing returning a very floating number and causing a broken BSP tree. If everything is OK, area is never flickering. Tarmation2 has some angles in geometry which cannot be checked easy if are coplanar and then we can't get rid of pain. I need to change strategy in dealing with this Level.
During this time I'll take a look at GoldenGirl - I'm really curious what crap was done there with those surfaces...
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Nelsona
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Re: Those wrong ones

Post by Nelsona » Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:48 pm

Quickly walking through GoldenGirl whatever fix4 version - I do not have any clue what was fixed here or supposed fixed.
My presumptions - The warning: I might be wrong here.
I believe these were attempts to fix was that annoying deliberated HOM effect or whatever - not 100% sure. Map uses Chaos assets which are "fascinating" - entirely not done for being used for/with Monsters..... ChaosUT is a mod addressing PLAYER and BOT and nothing like a SP MH COOP :| .

That stupid BT room I think might crash players here and there dues to "rendering" setup. This is a bug on purpose or a perfect dumb thing. Texture used for those walls are addressing usage for whatever grates/windows types intended to have a visual contact with some actors behind them. In this case we have The Void. As a matter of fact if a surface is like invisible in a map, we have that Hall Of Mirrors aka HOM effect because the void has no rendering surface UT trying to render last valid thing. This HOM means a bug. Due to texture used here we have a BUG directly set in map. For the brain-fart's fantasy, we can set this texture as a wall with void preventing HOM by declaring a texture behind it as FakeBackdrop and using that... Skybox. We can have a darkish skybox and player will be like in a cage locked without HOM craps. In my Sk_Godz I used this thing combined with a SkyBox creating a cage feeling with no pain. Nothing is more annoying than a HOM bugging player and boring for eyes. If you want a fix here I'm gonna destroy that HOM by replacing texture with anything else.
Returning from area is another dumb thing - evil player can block teleporter to base locking BT warriors in that stupid zone - if they don't die falling.
Actually stuff loaded here and setup is shocking me - fix4. What fix are we talking about ? Fixing HOM - replacing stable stuff with something bugged ? Chaos is the fix ?
A random picture makes me to have doubts about mental state of "mappers" fixing this thing.
What is that nice here ?
GoGiF4.PNG
GoGiF4.PNG (321.48 KiB) Viewed 1260 times
Another stupid textures with no sense ? Now I do recall about reason(s) for removal of this "map". That Mover...
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Learn the rules like a pro, so you can break them like an artist.
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imyourmomma_{HoF}
Posts: 41
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Re: Those wrong ones

Post by imyourmomma_{HoF} » Wed Jan 24, 2018 6:39 pm

I actually kind of like those colors lol. Someone suggested that the distorted textures in the first part of the map could have been done on purpose to make it harder to unlock the insta gun. I kind of thought that since the rest of the map is more normal besides the colorful textures. But I don't remember anything else being distorted. Guess I like the map because it is different than other maps. Doing a fix on the first part of the map with the textures would be a good thing though.

Nelsona
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Re: Those wrong ones

Post by Nelsona » Wed Jan 24, 2018 9:11 pm

Given said GoldenWoman's (or whatever Girl) way of doing (I recall even a render crash in that awesome area - on purpose) I've been boosted to continue working on a better version of Tarmation2. After a bunch of builds and less lucky tests - way too many miss-aligned solids ruining BSP tree, finally I got a better version (so far I did not encountered holes killing "players") and without that harmful visual glitches in "corners of view" map might be ready to rock - in hoping to not wrong... I will check it in my server with "all my people" and then if it do looks fine, perhaps I won't hesitate to add it here, as a small lesson not for mapper as much for as for those which were claiming to fix it (fix5 - nothing fixed). THIS task was pretty hard, I gotta admit...
I was figuring 51 zones then 53 and 54 and..., then over 63, real zones number is probably 55, the rest were BSP bugs causing leaks and null collision wall types... welding zones with the void.

Bot support here is not that complex as it's the map. Bot will trigger big elevator lift but they will not use it. Player has the duty to unlock shortcut-teleporter traveling and walking around lift. Bots will wait player on the ledge (if they can reach there) - probably attacking some monsters (depending on MH game-type used and server load - more or less blind). In my environment they have been attacking rocktentacles and even Titan visible around...
Kill-Zone room chapter
Paths there are brute-forced as long as Editor will not do normal paths in damage zones - after destroying panel (bots will shoot that) the room will be no longer damaging pawns.
The rest of map after that zone is... build in "angles" - heavy task to figure coplanar/non-coplanar polygons - I was waiting a "native support" which did not come - more than that, last build did not include any XC file loaded in Editor :| ...
Okay, I'm taking a break now.
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Nelsona
Posts: 271
Joined: Sat Sep 30, 2017 5:03 am

Re: Those wrong ones

Post by Nelsona » Fri Jan 26, 2018 10:20 pm

Door's bell was ringing. Delivery-boy brought the package. Right now this is what I'm using as map called Tarmation2 any...
MH-Sk_Tarmation2_Rev.zip
(2.9 MiB) Downloaded 64 times
There is also a bit of Bot Support, player must play for unlocking a shortcut, Bot will not use Big Elevator - not a goal right now, but will use Shortcut-Teleporter if can pass a small ledge through the Brutes area. Walls and floors should collide well right now...
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Learn the rules like a pro, so you can break them like an artist.
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evilgrins
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Re: Those wrong ones

Post by evilgrins » Fri Feb 16, 2018 4:04 am

"Update Reasons:
- stupid logic - map doesn't have ammo, I do not have a clue how do are we supposed to kill those monsters with only default load"

Talk them to death?

Run really far until they drop dead of exhaustion?
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Nelsona
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Joined: Sat Sep 30, 2017 5:03 am

Re: Those wrong ones

Post by Nelsona » Fri Feb 16, 2018 7:50 pm

:lol: Well said...

Okay, moving things a bit. If any people is interested about a bit loved map "final" called whatever ImperialBase but having a few polygons removed in purpose to not crash play at Max_Points UT's hard-coded limitation, then I can share some version. This version which I'm using is not attacked in details because I did patch module before and DU rules generally are based on "Retarded Bot" as one of main goals, so purpose is not to ruin their happiness but paths are injected in other cases where these are UT RULES. Also map has the rest of tweaking for preventing some door type crap toward A.I. and the rest of adds for LOADING STUPID AMMO and HEALTH using exactly what map do includes.
I gotta admit the Falcon ship do looks like it suffered some explosion but is the final point where I DO NOT ACCEPT players crashing and neither other invisible walls bugging battle zones, because by having all polys and all surfaces well build, player is crashing for going over engine's boundaries in final stage losing votes - ALL Players. As a matter of fact for me making that ship so complex makes no sense - player is not using it after all - and it is just pushing limits for NOTHING. Dumb troopers pawns dying like morons taunting happy, have now some more death-like animations. Saber weapon might be causing problems if map is not patched - not in XC cases but we are still using replacements for such bad things.

If "source-code" for map is a secret even after 6 years - I mean original map with brushes, then I had to recover it from its current stage (here original is dated 2012).

I cannot bet that it is completely errors-free (heavy to fix without brushes) but I see it more playable than original "final" - and RENAMED properly in LevelInfo because map has nothing like a SupaAngel inside, just bugs, and I think Supa Angel is not a bug it's a human being.
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Kelly
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Re: Those wrong ones

Post by Kelly » Sun Feb 18, 2018 1:01 am

Couple of things I might add...GoldenGirl is actually a dude and I talk to him from time to time. He's a little embarrassed I think about his early work and that's why he doesn't use the name any more. He mapped some under a new name (you've played his work for sure if you do MH) and I think he considers all the old stuff as abandoned. Last I talked with him he was done with mapping and UT completely and I haven't seen him in teamspeak for a little while. I can tell you though that he does not mind you changing any of his stuff, he's just glad that someone gets some use out of it.

SupaAngel was (is?) one of the regulars over at Destination Unreal before they had the rebellion and the staff all left. I don't know if she still plays there or not. She was young and posted some face and body shots and the guys there did what young guys will always do: everyone tried to get her attention. A couple of the mappers made 'tribute' maps for her and made things in her name to add to other maps. Boys will be boys....
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but we’re gonna die one day

Nelsona
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Joined: Sat Sep 30, 2017 5:03 am

Re: Those wrong ones

Post by Nelsona » Sun Feb 18, 2018 7:15 pm

I know Supa Angel and even Zasz (or such) - both of these have received "tribute" slash "presents" which Me personally I would politely refuse - it's just borked stuff. Such things (bad maps and bad compiled packages - read well - not only maps are f...ed up ) are not helpful at all.
I'm not rude or disrespectful, but this way community won't get any help. I 've done monsters "Nelsona" and "Gopostal" (if you recall them) but this doesn't mean that I have to do a map with them just for capturing attention to us - stuff must prove quality, aspect and player must feel a safe UT game rather than stupid walls making you to kill yourself and/or "accessed nones" errors loading log files...
Mapping is a hard task but not everyone get this point, which means mapping is not only a draw cubes task - which not even those things are not done well as I can see.
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Learn the rules like a pro, so you can break them like an artist.
- Pablo Picasso -

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